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he said "republicans are seriously considering a doomsday plan if fiscal cliff talks collapse entirely. it would be quite simple. house republicans would allow a vote on extending the bush middle class tax cuts. that bill already passed in august in the senate. and offer the president nothing more. no extension to the debt ceiling, nothing on unemployment, nothing on loopholes. congress would recess for the holidays and the president would face a big battle early in the year over the debt ceiling. two republican officials tell me this is becoming the most likely scenario. "the new york times" added more detail including this amazing quote from rep michael c. burgess of texas. "there's always better ground, but we have to get there." in this case the better ground is exchanging the threat of a congressionally induced recession for the threat of a congressionally induced global financial crisis combined with recession. that, that is your better ground? that's a big plan? it's not -- it's not better ground for the economy. and, frankly, i find it difficult to see how it's better political
he said "republicans are seriously considering a doomsday plan if fiscal cliff talks collapse entirely. it would be quite simple. house republicans would allow a vote on extending the bush middle class tax cuts. that bill already passed in august in the senate. and offer the president nothing more. no extension to the debt ceiling, nothing on unemployment, nothing on loopholes. congress would recess for the holidays and the president would face a big battle early in the year over the debt...
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hikes for top income earners. >> is the administration prepared to go over the fiscal cliff? >> absolutely. there's no prospect for an agreement that doesn't involve those rates going up on the top 2% of the wealthiest americans. it's only 2%. >> reporter: republicans insist they can get the revenue from reforming the tax code without increasing tax rates. >> the revenues put on the table are going to come from guess who? the rich. >> reporter: but the president says that won't work. >> it is not possible for us to raise the apartment
hikes for top income earners. >> is the administration prepared to go over the fiscal cliff? >> absolutely. there's no prospect for an agreement that doesn't involve those rates going up on the top 2% of the wealthiest americans. it's only 2%. >> reporter: republicans insist they can get the revenue from reforming the tax code without increasing tax rates. >> the revenues put on the table are going to come from guess who? the rich. >> reporter: but the president...
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cliff. it is a $2.2 trillion offer that does not raise the tax rate on the wealthiest americans and that has become the central issue of the negotiations. the white house says republicans still are not ready to get serious. susan mcginnis is in washington with the back and forth details. susan, good morning to you. >> reporter: good morning, terrell. gop leaders here on capitol hill sent their plan to the white house in this letter on monday, and now that both initial offers are out there, both sides say it's time to get serious. governors from six states are headed here to washington today to tell president obama their thoughts on the fiscal cliff. the bipartisan group says both sides need to work together to avoid the tax increases and spending cuts due to kick in at the end of the year. >> no one's going to get what they want, but as a country to move forward, we've got to figure out who gives where, and if everything is going to be out on the table, how do we negotiate that? >> reporter:
cliff. it is a $2.2 trillion offer that does not raise the tax rate on the wealthiest americans and that has become the central issue of the negotiations. the white house says republicans still are not ready to get serious. susan mcginnis is in washington with the back and forth details. susan, good morning to you. >> reporter: good morning, terrell. gop leaders here on capitol hill sent their plan to the white house in this letter on monday, and now that both initial offers are out...
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cliff if the gop does not agree to raise those rates. this was treasury secretary geithner earlier today on cnbc. >> is the administration prepared to go over the fiscal cliff? >> oh, absolutely. there's no prospect to an agreement that doesn't involve those rates going up on the top 2% of the wealthiest. all americans get a tax cut on the first $250,000 of their income. so, in some sense it's a tax cut for all americans. >> reporter: bottom line, anderson, we're talking today but still at stalemate. >> yeah, i mean, it's a sign, jessica and dana, of just how lack -- how little progress there's been that a phone call is big news between these two. dana, we're hearing hints of some move between republicans, coburn, olympia snowe, how significant is it? >> reporter: it's significant for a couple reasons. you're right, three republicans in different ways suggested they would be okay with what most republicans are saying, that they're not okay with, which is raising tax rates for the wealthiest. tom is the most conservative, in general, not
cliff if the gop does not agree to raise those rates. this was treasury secretary geithner earlier today on cnbc. >> is the administration prepared to go over the fiscal cliff? >> oh, absolutely. there's no prospect to an agreement that doesn't involve those rates going up on the top 2% of the wealthiest. all americans get a tax cut on the first $250,000 of their income. so, in some sense it's a tax cut for all americans. >> reporter: bottom line, anderson, we're talking today...
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. >> is the administration prepared to go over the fiscal cliff? >> oh, absolutely. again, we say there's no prospect for an agreement that doesn't involve those tax rates going up. remember, it's 2%. remember, all of those americans, too, get a tax cut into that framework on the first $250,000 of their income. >> that said the president and speaker john boehner discussed the budget by phone yesterday. susan mcginnis is in washington with the latest on this game of fiscal chicken. susan, good morning to you. >> right. good morning, terrell. yeah, that phone call does raise the possibility that some serious talks could start soon, but now we learn that a lot of members of congress are heading out on a long weekend, not to return till tuesday. this as the impasse here on capitol hill continues and the nation waits. social security workers marched outside their office in baltimore wednesday. they're protesting the government spending cuts due to kick in at the end of the year as part of the fiscal cliff. >> we don't want to see our public hurt in any way. >> just down t
. >> is the administration prepared to go over the fiscal cliff? >> oh, absolutely. again, we say there's no prospect for an agreement that doesn't involve those tax rates going up. remember, it's 2%. remember, all of those americans, too, get a tax cut into that framework on the first $250,000 of their income. >> that said the president and speaker john boehner discussed the budget by phone yesterday. susan mcginnis is in washington with the latest on this game of fiscal...
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but does so without raising tax rates for top income earners. the president says that's unacceptable. >> we're going to have to see the rates on the top 2% go up. and we're not going to be able to get a deal without it. >> reporter: republicans, like rising star senator marco rubio, say raising taxes on the wealthy is the wrong approach. >> the tax increases he wants would fail to make even a small dent in the debt. it would hurt middle-class businesses and the people who work for them. >> reporter: so, that's the major holdup, taxes. republicans and democrats deeply divided. >> there's nothing going on privately that's not going on public. >> reporter: amidst the political posturing, there may actually be a chance for compromise on medicare. president obama says he's open to raising the age when seniors can start receiving benefits, from 65 to 67. according to one study, that would save almost $6 billion a year. president obama travels, today, to the business roundtable, where he'll address ceos of leading companies, folks who are closely watch
but does so without raising tax rates for top income earners. the president says that's unacceptable. >> we're going to have to see the rates on the top 2% go up. and we're not going to be able to get a deal without it. >> reporter: republicans, like rising star senator marco rubio, say raising taxes on the wealthy is the wrong approach. >> the tax increases he wants would fail to make even a small dent in the debt. it would hurt middle-class businesses and the people who work...
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you've got to be for a tax rate increase or we will go over this fiscal cliff. >> no, you don't. you could raise from a carbon tax of $20 a ton, which will deal with, we are having the biggest record carbon levels. you could raise -- at 4% a year over the next ten year, twice as much as you could from allowing the bush tax rates to lapse. why the income tax system is overburdened in the united states. we use it too much. we should be looking at other taxes. we can't do it in 29 days. why are we doing it in 29 days? >> but the president ran on raises taxes, right? if you look at the polls. 60% of people support raising taxes on people who make over $250,000 a year. how much of a problem is it, david, if the republicans you know, tom coburn said he does not want to raise that tax number. >> the president ran on his first term on opposing a health care mandate. he was against that. presidents change their minds. the idea that you would do a revenue measure with an eye to basically doing something punitive, when there are much more important policy goals you can achieve and when it's
you've got to be for a tax rate increase or we will go over this fiscal cliff. >> no, you don't. you could raise from a carbon tax of $20 a ton, which will deal with, we are having the biggest record carbon levels. you could raise -- at 4% a year over the next ten year, twice as much as you could from allowing the bush tax rates to lapse. why the income tax system is overburdened in the united states. we use it too much. we should be looking at other taxes. we can't do it in 29 days. why...
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so with 29 days to go until the fiscal cliff, what would it take to get a deal? joining me now, men on opposite sides, grover norquist, president of americans for tax reform and robert reish, former secretary of labor for president bill clinton and the author of "beyond outrage." none of the three of us are beyond outrage, grover norquist, which is why i keep having you back. the situation it seems to me as an impartial observer here is that both sides have now made fairly ludicrous offers that they know the other side is never going to accept in a million years. that does beg the question, grover, why bother, given that both sides know where they need to move, why the games? >> well, it's not clear that both sides know. the week after the election, president obama was asked do you have to have the higher rates or could we have deductions and credits and he said he was open to negotiations. three weeks later, after thanksgiving, he shows up and all of a sudden there's a line in the sand on rates that had come out of nowhere, so the president seems to be moving th
so with 29 days to go until the fiscal cliff, what would it take to get a deal? joining me now, men on opposite sides, grover norquist, president of americans for tax reform and robert reish, former secretary of labor for president bill clinton and the author of "beyond outrage." none of the three of us are beyond outrage, grover norquist, which is why i keep having you back. the situation it seems to me as an impartial observer here is that both sides have now made fairly ludicrous...
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house republicans today did offer a counter proposal on the fiscal cliff. their plan, $2.2 trillion deficit savings over the next decade, but it does not include higher tax rates for the wealthy. the house speaker john boehner calls it a credible plan that deserves serious consideration by the white house. guess what? the white house released a statement tonight saying the plan is nothing new, that it lowers rates for the wealthy and sticks the middle class with the bill. so to borrow a phrase, we're nowhere. period. david walker is president and ceo of comeback america initiative. he's made it his mission to promote fiscal responsibility. he joins us along with cnn political analyst, david gergen. david walker, let me start with you. the house republicans put forward their counter proposal. speaker boehner says it's credible and the white house should consider it. is it credible or is it more of what you have called the irresponsible unethical immoral behavior of all the politicians here in washington? >> i think both sides are now putting things on the ta
house republicans today did offer a counter proposal on the fiscal cliff. their plan, $2.2 trillion deficit savings over the next decade, but it does not include higher tax rates for the wealthy. the house speaker john boehner calls it a credible plan that deserves serious consideration by the white house. guess what? the white house released a statement tonight saying the plan is nothing new, that it lowers rates for the wealthy and sticks the middle class with the bill. so to borrow a phrase,...
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let's talk about the fiscal cliff. the president says the republicans have to agree to raising the marginal tax rate for the wealthiest top 2% from 35%. does he mean it has to go back up to 39.6% as was the case during the clinton administration or is there some wiggle room in between 35% and 39.6%? >> the president has repeatedly said there's room for compromise. but what this boils down to is a matter of fairness and a matter of math. giving certainty to the middle class is essential. there's no way mathematically, if you look at the republican's proposal, that you can get to the deficit reduction that we need to with preserving the middle class tax cuts by not increasing as the republicans refuse to do the upper tier rates. there's room for discussion, but that -- >> so the 39.6%, that's not a red line? >> as far as i know and the conversations i've had, the president has said there's room for compromise, but for the red line to be drawn in the sand by republicans to say that an increase in rates on the wealthiest a
let's talk about the fiscal cliff. the president says the republicans have to agree to raising the marginal tax rate for the wealthiest top 2% from 35%. does he mean it has to go back up to 39.6% as was the case during the clinton administration or is there some wiggle room in between 35% and 39.6%? >> the president has repeatedly said there's room for compromise. but what this boils down to is a matter of fairness and a matter of math. giving certainty to the middle class is essential....
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fiscal cliff as a three-part problem. part one taxes. in the new year, taxes go up on everyone unless washington takes action. the government needs more money. president obama wants to get some of it from the top 2% of wage earners. he wants to raise their tax rate and limit how much they can deduct. the white house says this will bring in $1.6 trillion over ten years. >> that's what the american people have voted for. >> republicans say they'll agree to bring in more money, but not by raising tax rates. in fact, they want to lower tax rates for everyone. instead they'd raise money only by limits deductions and closing loopholes. speaker boehner says this will raise $800 billion over ten years. >> america faces a serious problem. our goal is to make sure it gets solved. >> step two, avoiding the drastic spending cuts that begin on january 1st, the so-called sequester. both sides want to find savings in medicare, but disagree about how to do it. >> we need a responsible white house. we can't sit here and negotiate with our
fiscal cliff as a three-part problem. part one taxes. in the new year, taxes go up on everyone unless washington takes action. the government needs more money. president obama wants to get some of it from the top 2% of wage earners. he wants to raise their tax rate and limit how much they can deduct. the white house says this will bring in $1.6 trillion over ten years. >> that's what the american people have voted for. >> republicans say they'll agree to bring in more money, but not...
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. >> so a lot of democrats are saying that no big deal if you go over the fiscal cliff. it seems like republicans are moving towards giving in on the tax rates. might even just vote on the tax portion of the negotiations and kick the rest into january to deal with. if you get a deal on the taxes that president obama seems like he would sign, what happens to the government on the second half of the cliff, the sequester and other extenders? you were at omb. can the government deal with that? can we be okay? >> there's a lot of ifs. republicans don't want to raise taxes on the middle class. they want to pass a bill to prevent increase on rates on the middle class. that would be a good thing. if we got past january 3rd and the sequester went into effect, there are a ways to move through money in accounts where you can buy a few weeks. that's an important thing to do. now don't get me wrong. there would still be a huge impa impact. i don't know what the markets would do. wall street is in a mind if we go past january 3rd, we will fall off the cliff. and secondly, there are pe
. >> so a lot of democrats are saying that no big deal if you go over the fiscal cliff. it seems like republicans are moving towards giving in on the tax rates. might even just vote on the tax portion of the negotiations and kick the rest into january to deal with. if you get a deal on the taxes that president obama seems like he would sign, what happens to the government on the second half of the cliff, the sequester and other extenders? you were at omb. can the government deal with...
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. >> should there be a compromise in order to avoid going over the fiscal cliff? john boehner's already $800 billion in increased tax revenue, not necessarily raising the marginal tax rate on the wealthy, but capping deductions, limiting loopholes, are you with the speaker of the house on that? >> unfortunately, wolf, the policies of president obama have already taken us over the cliff. if you meet with businesses like i do all the time, they've already paired back plans for next year anticipating what's going to happen. we can fix this christmas eve if we want, but we've already hurt the economy and job growth. >> are you with boehner? >> i'm not with boehner. this government doesn't need anymore money. this country needs less government. we're going to have historic levels of revenue to the government this year. >> everyone's taxes are going up at the end of the year if there's no deal. >> we have already offered to extend current tax rates. that's what we should have done six months ago until we could come to some agreement, some compromise on tax reform. >> wh
. >> should there be a compromise in order to avoid going over the fiscal cliff? john boehner's already $800 billion in increased tax revenue, not necessarily raising the marginal tax rate on the wealthy, but capping deductions, limiting loopholes, are you with the speaker of the house on that? >> unfortunately, wolf, the policies of president obama have already taken us over the cliff. if you meet with businesses like i do all the time, they've already paired back plans for next...
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cliff. >> it's very important we get it done now. >> reporter: republicans and democrats are talking again. but still, no breakthrough. the parties are locked in a stalemate. president obama is demanding that higher tax rates for the wealthy and a permanent extension of the debt ceiling, the government's ability to borrow money, be part of the deal. >> he's assuming unprecedented power to spend taxpayer dollars out any limit at all. >> reporter: republicans who say they're open to raising tax revenue say they will only do so in exchange for deep spending cuts. if washington can't strike a deal, one casualty will be compensation for the long-term unemployed. that means people like linda vega, are worried. >> christmas and things of that nature are probably off the table. >> reporter: aides to president obama and speaker boehner met yesterday afternoon. but that meeting ended with no discernible signs of progress. rob and paula? >> thanks, tahman. >>> once the numbers are all tallied, they're going to show that the 2012 presidential election was the most expensive in history. campaign
cliff. >> it's very important we get it done now. >> reporter: republicans and democrats are talking again. but still, no breakthrough. the parties are locked in a stalemate. president obama is demanding that higher tax rates for the wealthy and a permanent extension of the debt ceiling, the government's ability to borrow money, be part of the deal. >> he's assuming unprecedented power to spend taxpayer dollars out any limit at all. >> reporter: republicans who say...
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cliff and also they feel like think eve kind of got republicans in a corner because these income tax rates are set to increase in everyone at the end of the year and kind of hold that over their heads. now, at the same time, obviously, the issue here continuing to be tax rates and the white house really wants to deal with that. increase tax rates on the wealthy and then they want to deal with tax reform, entitlement reform later. somehow maybe link them but deal with that later and so they're really drawing this line in the sand as you heard timothy geithner say that the tax rates need to go up for wealthy americans. >> there's a strategy here. so, anna, republican strategist, why aren't republicans offering their own plan in return? isn't that how you negotiate? >> i think first they wanted to see what the president puts on the table. they have seen it. they don't like it. it doesn't have cuts in spending and entitlement reform. they want that. but i think what we're watching right now and see it for the next few days play out, a lot of posturing. this is a game of chicken. who's go
cliff and also they feel like think eve kind of got republicans in a corner because these income tax rates are set to increase in everyone at the end of the year and kind of hold that over their heads. now, at the same time, obviously, the issue here continuing to be tax rates and the white house really wants to deal with that. increase tax rates on the wealthy and then they want to deal with tax reform, entitlement reform later. somehow maybe link them but deal with that later and so they're...
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fiscal cliff, beyond the fiscal cliff. let me get to this steve. this is about including the debt ceiling. and what the president said about that in this negotiation today. >> we are not going to play that game next year. >> if congress in any way suggests they will tie negotiation to debt ceiling votes and take us to the brink of default once again, part of a budget negotiation, which by the way we have never done in our history until we did it last year. i will not play that game. because we have to break that habit before it starts. >> bret: what about that? >> well, the president had as many red lines for iran as for house republicans. i think what kirsten said is absolutely remarkable. it is about the scalp. it's about the president having made a campaign argument for the better part of 2012. so that he could run a class warfare campaign. now having to make good on that with the base of his party. the u.s. economy be damned. the republicans offered to give so much and offering precisely what erskine bowles laid out as a compromise position in
fiscal cliff, beyond the fiscal cliff. let me get to this steve. this is about including the debt ceiling. and what the president said about that in this negotiation today. >> we are not going to play that game next year. >> if congress in any way suggests they will tie negotiation to debt ceiling votes and take us to the brink of default once again, part of a budget negotiation, which by the way we have never done in our history until we did it last year. i will not play that game....
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fiscal cliff still hanging over us. markets, at least, are telling us that we think washington will get its act together, avert the fiscal cliff and like what they see from the jobs report this morning. >> my goodness. that's optimism there. can you talk to me a little more about this job market shrinking and that maybe why the unemployment rate dropped? >> two surveys that the government takes, household survey where they call thos thousands of people at home and ask, are you working? that's the number that gives us the unemployment rate. they also talked to thousands and thousands of companies and they say how many jobs do you have? how many jobs have you added? that's how you get that net job creation number up 146,000. when the government calls people up and they say i'm not working or i've dropped out of the labor market or whatever, you can see just how big the labor market is. we know that there are some, i think, 300,000 some people who have dropped out of the labor market. they've either dropped out. they could
fiscal cliff still hanging over us. markets, at least, are telling us that we think washington will get its act together, avert the fiscal cliff and like what they see from the jobs report this morning. >> my goodness. that's optimism there. can you talk to me a little more about this job market shrinking and that maybe why the unemployment rate dropped? >> two surveys that the government takes, household survey where they call thos thousands of people at home and ask, are you...
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. >> reporter: on his first view sbr interview on the fiscal cliff, he rejected john boehner's proposal. >> unfortunately the speaker's proposal is out of balance. >> reporter: raising taxes on households earning more than $250,000. >> we'll have to see the rates on the top 2% go up. we're not going to be able to get a deal without it. >> reporter: republicans want smaller tax increases overall and no movement on higher income tax rates. they want to cut unnamed tax bre breaks and deductions, which they say will do more to boost economic growth. the white house considers the proposal and economic rationale behind it laughable. >> we don't know what we're talking about in terms of actual legislation to increase revenues. it's magic beans and fairy dust. >> reporter: republicans answered back ba-humbug. >> this is absolutely not serious and the administration knows it. >> reporter: six governors, three from each party, met the president and said acid they believe business leaders in their states won't invest and hire until a deal gets done. >> until this gets resolved in a way that's not
. >> reporter: on his first view sbr interview on the fiscal cliff, he rejected john boehner's proposal. >> unfortunately the speaker's proposal is out of balance. >> reporter: raising taxes on households earning more than $250,000. >> we'll have to see the rates on the top 2% go up. we're not going to be able to get a deal without it. >> reporter: republicans want smaller tax increases overall and no movement on higher income tax rates. they want to cut unnamed...
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the so-called fiscal cliff is really all about the obama ultimate may tum. >> i'm not going to sign a package that somehow prevents the top rates from going up for folks at the top 2%. lou: president's ultimatum and his insistence on higher taxes may take us over the cliff. chris and steven next. the next scott walker? michigan's republican governor ready to do plitical battle with organized labor in his state. what about a right to work law? straight ahead. [beep] [indistinct chatter] [kids talking at once] [speaking reign language] [heart beating] [heartbeat continues] [faint singing] [heartbeat, music playing louder] ♪ i'm feeling better since you know me ♪ ♪ i was a lonely soul, but that's the old me... ♪ announcer: this song was created with heartbeats of children in need. find out how it can help frontline health workers bring hope to millions of children at everybeatmatters.org. lou: the staffs of both president obama and house speaker boehner are talking, but there is still no word of progress on the so-called fiscal cliff or the president's ultimatum. silence indicate
the so-called fiscal cliff is really all about the obama ultimate may tum. >> i'm not going to sign a package that somehow prevents the top rates from going up for folks at the top 2%. lou: president's ultimatum and his insistence on higher taxes may take us over the cliff. chris and steven next. the next scott walker? michigan's republican governor ready to do plitical battle with organized labor in his state. what about a right to work law? straight ahead. [beep] [indistinct chatter]...
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on the fiscal cliff. >> how does it play into fiscal cliff negotiation? >> you would think it gives them a sobering sense of if we do the right thing, maybe the economy keeps growing, if we do the wrong thing, might tip the united states. some think even the possibility of another global recession. you would think it would be a motivation to get things done. if you listen to what's said publicly, see if they're working out a deal privately, there are staff level conversations but most of the big voices dug in. >> you had a fascinating interview with the head of the international monitoring fund, it will air sunday on "state of the union." let me play a clip. what happens in fiscal cliff negotiations in washington could have a huge impact around the world. >> there's still that degree of uncertainty that fuels doubt, that prevents investors, entrepreneurs, households from making decisions because they don't know what tomorrow will be. they know that a fix has been found for today but there is still work to be done tomorrow and day after tomorrow. so it wou
on the fiscal cliff. >> how does it play into fiscal cliff negotiation? >> you would think it gives them a sobering sense of if we do the right thing, maybe the economy keeps growing, if we do the wrong thing, might tip the united states. some think even the possibility of another global recession. you would think it would be a motivation to get things done. if you listen to what's said publicly, see if they're working out a deal privately, there are staff level conversations but...
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the so-called fiscal cliff is really all about the obama ultimate may tum. >> i'm not going to sign any package that somehow prevents the top rates from going up for folks at the top 2%. lou: president's ultimatum and his insistence on higher taxes may take us over the cliff. chris and steven next. the next scott walker? michigan's republican governor ready to do political battle with organized labor in his state. what about a right to work law? straight ahead. the boys use capital one venture miles for thr annual football trip. that's double miles you can actually use. tragically, their ddy got sacked by blackouts. but it's our tradition! that's roughing the card holder. buwith the capital one venture card you get double miles you can actually use. [ cheering ] any flight, anytime. the scoreboard doesn't lie. what's in your wallet? hut! i have me on my fantasy team. if you're a man with low testosterone, you should know that axiron is here. the only underarm treatment for low t. that's right, the one you apply to the underarm. axiron is not for use in women or anyone younger than 18. a
the so-called fiscal cliff is really all about the obama ultimate may tum. >> i'm not going to sign any package that somehow prevents the top rates from going up for folks at the top 2%. lou: president's ultimatum and his insistence on higher taxes may take us over the cliff. chris and steven next. the next scott walker? michigan's republican governor ready to do political battle with organized labor in his state. what about a right to work law? straight ahead. the boys use capital one...
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the biggest issue that's causing the fiscal cliff is the tax rates going up on the middle class. especially in this time now when we're getting out of this recession. we're seeing some robust growth. we want the christmas sales to be good. if the middle class knew that they're going to keep their tax cut, it would put a smile on everybody's face. and both parties can take credit for it. why won't they do it? there's only one answer. they're obsessed with protecting billionaires and millionaires. it's a sad state of affairs. >> one thing that we've seen in the days leading up, at least through this week, that there has been optimism from both sides expressed by speaker boehner, also by the president, and also republican tom cole, congre congressman, seem to be on board. now we have conservatives like charles krauthammer putting out their pieces saying let's go over the fiscal cliff, let the president do this. then john cornyn, republican from texas, saying apparently the president wants us to go over the fiscal cliff. this is serious business, demanding higher taxes, more stimulus
the biggest issue that's causing the fiscal cliff is the tax rates going up on the middle class. especially in this time now when we're getting out of this recession. we're seeing some robust growth. we want the christmas sales to be good. if the middle class knew that they're going to keep their tax cut, it would put a smile on everybody's face. and both parties can take credit for it. why won't they do it? there's only one answer. they're obsessed with protecting billionaires and...
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we'll go off the fiscal cliff, down the fiscal slope. yes i think it will happen because it is the one way republicans can, without violating the pledge, and offending the grand inquisitor grover norquist, it's the one way they can let this happen. >> and, in fact, you know, what could happen, you can imagine a scenario where you go off the cliff on taxes, rates go up for everybody, you then vote to restore the rates for the vast majority of taxpayers, 98%, and further it is even conceivable you negotiate down the top rates in the level under bill clinton a little bit by putting in the pot offsetting deductions for credits which would allow republicans to claim some sort of victory as well. that could be a scenario where you have a consensus on the tax run. >> let's run all of this by representative xavier becerra of california. he's joining us now. nice to see you, sir 367 appreciate your time. what is really the white house dismiss kind of out of hand i mean i don't have the exact number of minutes that they had this republican proposa
we'll go off the fiscal cliff, down the fiscal slope. yes i think it will happen because it is the one way republicans can, without violating the pledge, and offending the grand inquisitor grover norquist, it's the one way they can let this happen. >> and, in fact, you know, what could happen, you can imagine a scenario where you go off the cliff on taxes, rates go up for everybody, you then vote to restore the rates for the vast majority of taxpayers, 98%, and further it is even...
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caller: looking at the fiscal cliff, we go back to 2001 with the lowering of the tax rates, meant to create jobs. but in the past 10 or 11 years, we have not had any job creation whatsoever. we keep going back and hearing over and over again that it's going to cost jobs. we do not have jobs to begin with. businesses are out to make money. if consumers do not have money to spend, then you can lower their taxes to 0%. they still cannot spend because they do not have any income. guest: i think that is a great point. it brings up one thing we have not mentioned yet. the payroll tax cut is about to expire. if that expires, every paycheck in the country is going to go down about $1,000 on january 1st. that would hurt consumption. it would hurt the customers of businesses. the president has proposed to extend that. i think that is reasonable. we will see a firm public and keep up their opposition or they give in. we have a sleeper here that cannot be ignored. if we do not extend that, every paycheck in the country is going to go down. guest: i agree. we should extend that for another year.
caller: looking at the fiscal cliff, we go back to 2001 with the lowering of the tax rates, meant to create jobs. but in the past 10 or 11 years, we have not had any job creation whatsoever. we keep going back and hearing over and over again that it's going to cost jobs. we do not have jobs to begin with. businesses are out to make money. if consumers do not have money to spend, then you can lower their taxes to 0%. they still cannot spend because they do not have any income. guest: i think...
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starbucks ceo has sobering advice to offer on the looming fiscal cliff, that the consequences will be far worse than last year's debt ceiling fight when the u.s. credit rating was downgraded for the first time ever. his message to lawmakers, now is not the time to play politics. it's about doing right by the american people. >> i think if people would get in the room and leave their ego behind, and not be so skewed towards the party but be so sensitive to the lens of the american people, we will have an agreement. >> poppy harlow is joining us with more. we've been talking about how this will affect us. schultz says this goes way beyond our boarders. >> it's global. something that stuck with me talking to him about this, the people who need a deal most will be hurt the most. here's why. >> this single issue has a seismic affect on the rest of the world, that we have never been as connected and the domino effect of a bad outcome here will have significant negative consequences, domestically and around the world, not the least of which will be the level -- the fracturing of confidence i
starbucks ceo has sobering advice to offer on the looming fiscal cliff, that the consequences will be far worse than last year's debt ceiling fight when the u.s. credit rating was downgraded for the first time ever. his message to lawmakers, now is not the time to play politics. it's about doing right by the american people. >> i think if people would get in the room and leave their ego behind, and not be so skewed towards the party but be so sensitive to the lens of the american people,...
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cliff policies and they made a projection that while 2013, if all of the fiscal cliff things and all is enacted in congress and you do nothing to stop the tax rate increases for everybody, 2013 will be bad but by 2018 and 2020 we will be a better did debt to gdp ratio than we've had in decades, that we will be running budget surpluses and we'll be full deployment. do you believe the analysis of the fiscal cliff impact was too rosy? >> projections are very difficult. it's very difficult to take into account the effect on confidence. as i said, consumers have been confident. they've maintained that confidence. but look at what happened during the debt limit debacle a year ago august. look at how the economy came to a grinding halt at that point. >> and that's your fear that the cliff could just freeze consume earp confidence and that's something you can't right now project as an economist? >> no one wants to go over the fiscal cliff. worse would be for the president to sign a bad bill. >> all right. alan krueger, chairman of the president's counscil on economi advisers. mr. krueger, ni
cliff policies and they made a projection that while 2013, if all of the fiscal cliff things and all is enacted in congress and you do nothing to stop the tax rate increases for everybody, 2013 will be bad but by 2018 and 2020 we will be a better did debt to gdp ratio than we've had in decades, that we will be running budget surpluses and we'll be full deployment. do you believe the analysis of the fiscal cliff impact was too rosy? >> projections are very difficult. it's very difficult to...
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and you know, there are some taxes that would go up if we two off the fiscal cliff. you're talking about a family that makes about $50,000 having a tax increase of $4,000. melissa: congresswoman, this drives me crazy. when we look at all the numbers we immediately start taing about taxes. it seems like we're looking for revenue under every single rock. that's fine. even if we raised taxes that are proposed by the white house, it will raise $82 billion. it is one half of 1% of the problem. have a $16.3 trillion debt. all of this talk about raising taxes doesn't get us even close to solving the problem. it doesn't even start the conversation. it is not a drop in the bucket. we've got to reform our spending or grow the economy. but just raising taxes isn't going to do it. >> well, i agree with you 100%. that's why the president as well as the democrats have called for a balanced approach. so of course we can't raise enough taxes to completely deal witthe deficit. and you do have to do reforms. you need to reform the tax system. you certainly need to make additional cuts
and you know, there are some taxes that would go up if we two off the fiscal cliff. you're talking about a family that makes about $50,000 having a tax increase of $4,000. melissa: congresswoman, this drives me crazy. when we look at all the numbers we immediately start taing about taxes. it seems like we're looking for revenue under every single rock. that's fine. even if we raised taxes that are proposed by the white house, it will raise $82 billion. it is one half of 1% of the problem. have...
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on the fiscal cliff. judge andrew napolitano. fox news senior judicial analyst. juan williams, columnist with tannehill. byron york from the "washington examiner." judge, what do you make of this? we had back and forth and we talk about this every day. every day there are developments. >> the president insistence on raising tax rate is reprehensible and violates economics 101. raising tax rates will not necessarily produce more revenue. the president is more interested to punish the rich and perceived reward for base. doesn't put more money in the federal treasury. the republicans give in to this in spirit of compromise, i respect alan simpson. but this is a time for the republicans to say no to spending no, borrowing. no to taxes. do you any any republicans sent to congress to facilitate the president spending to us oblivion? they no. or they will be sent home. >> president feels like he was elected on a campaign where he mentioned on the stump many times, raising tax rates. >> i understand that. >> but under our system the congress writes the law and president
on the fiscal cliff. judge andrew napolitano. fox news senior judicial analyst. juan williams, columnist with tannehill. byron york from the "washington examiner." judge, what do you make of this? we had back and forth and we talk about this every day. every day there are developments. >> the president insistence on raising tax rate is reprehensible and violates economics 101. raising tax rates will not necessarily produce more revenue. the president is more interested to punish...
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quite frankly, some people in this 2% who call me, they're more worried about the fiscal cliff than they are about rates going up a couple of points." congressman thomas rooney of florida said, "if there are truly real entitlement reforms that are going to be preserve social security and medicare for generations to come, it's going to be difficult for me to oppose higher rates for the rich." president obama and speaker boehner spoke by phone yesterday for the first time in a week. white house press secretary jay carney i find very interesting refused to characterize the conversation. let's bring in congressman chris van hollen of maryland tonight. good to have you with us. >> always good to when with you. >> you bet. are democrats united on this rate issue? we keep hearing it. now that boehner is starting to move a little bit and say that the money is going to come from the wealthy, yet he hasn't identified these reductions, where do democrats stand on rates? is that the bottom line? the rates have to go up? >> the rates have to go up, ed. it's a matter of simple math, as the president h
quite frankly, some people in this 2% who call me, they're more worried about the fiscal cliff than they are about rates going up a couple of points." congressman thomas rooney of florida said, "if there are truly real entitlement reforms that are going to be preserve social security and medicare for generations to come, it's going to be difficult for me to oppose higher rates for the rich." president obama and speaker boehner spoke by phone yesterday for the first time in a...
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i believe we can avoid the fiscal cliff and address our massive deficit but that requires doing three essential things: reforming our tax code, reforming entitlement programs, and better controlling our spending. we can get additional revenue by reforming our tax code. that means closing loopholes and limiting deductions. by closing loopholes and limiting deductions, we can make the tax code -- tax code simpler and fairer to stimulate growth in our economy. markets get the kind of certainty they need to invest, to grow and to hire. it's a growing economy, a growing economic base that creates more jobs and revenue, not higher taxes. the simple fact is, we must make america a great place to do business again. our pro-growth strategies in my home state of north dakota have broadened our economic base and raised revenue without raising taxes. that has resulted in the lowest unemployment rate in the nation. growing personal income and rather than a deficit, a budget surplus. in addition to pro-growth tax reform, we also need to start a fair and thoughtful process to reform entitlement prog
i believe we can avoid the fiscal cliff and address our massive deficit but that requires doing three essential things: reforming our tax code, reforming entitlement programs, and better controlling our spending. we can get additional revenue by reforming our tax code. that means closing loopholes and limiting deductions. by closing loopholes and limiting deductions, we can make the tax code -- tax code simpler and fairer to stimulate growth in our economy. markets get the kind of certainty...
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cliff, he has done nothing to demonstrate it. the position of congressman tom cole, that the party should agree immediately to extend the bush tax rates for americans making less than $250,000 a year is the best of a bunch of bad choices for the gop. >> the g 0 op is boxed in saying it's a terrible position because by default democrats get what they want. a big bargaining chip for house republicans is they need congress to raise the debt ceiling before the end of february when analysts estimate the treasury would run out of options and hit the borrowing cap. no deal is reached. closer to the deadline and today they will argue that's bad for business. help in supporting an approach without drama or delay a. >> we can't be going through another debt crisis, debt ceiling crisis like in 2011. that has to be dealt with. >> the president of the business roundtable has said congress should raise the debt ceiling enough for the next five years to avoid uncertainty. clearly that's something that won't happen. short term spending cuts shou
cliff, he has done nothing to demonstrate it. the position of congressman tom cole, that the party should agree immediately to extend the bush tax rates for americans making less than $250,000 a year is the best of a bunch of bad choices for the gop. >> the g 0 op is boxed in saying it's a terrible position because by default democrats get what they want. a big bargaining chip for house republicans is they need congress to raise the debt ceiling before the end of february when analysts...
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the timing is interesting, obviously, just as we're learning that fiscal cliff negotiations are now a party of two, the president and the speaker. the "new york times" reporting that house speaker john boehner wants to speak only to president obama out of public view. though we've just learned that boehner is holding a news conference at 11:00 this morning eastern time. the fight, though, still very public. vice president joe biden is meeting with a middle class family. and yesterday president obama met with a virginia family. tax hikes for the rich are nonnegotiable. >> just to be clear, i'm not going to sign any package that somehow prevents the top rate from going up for folks at the top 2%. but i do remain optimistic that we can get something done that is for families like this one. >> joining me now is barry, msnbc political contributor and editor for grio. hello, guys. >> perry, i'm wondering if these new unemployment numbers add to the president's leverage? >> i think they do. the big thing is the election. but the jobs numbers suggest that the economy is doing well and it cuts
the timing is interesting, obviously, just as we're learning that fiscal cliff negotiations are now a party of two, the president and the speaker. the "new york times" reporting that house speaker john boehner wants to speak only to president obama out of public view. though we've just learned that boehner is holding a news conference at 11:00 this morning eastern time. the fight, though, still very public. vice president joe biden is meeting with a middle class family. and yesterday...
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they're also concerned that the fiscal cliff is keeping jobs from hiring. vice president joe biden will have lunch with a group of middle class americans. their taxes could sky rocket if congress and president obama don't reach an agreement on a budget by the end of the year. the white house has highlighted several middle class families' struggles in making the case for a deal. >>> in syria tensioned at a boiling point between rebels and the government. syrian rebels have declared damascus international airport a military target, warning civilians and airlines not to approach it. this comes as reports of the government preparing to use chemical weapons on the civilians there. since march of 2011, 40,000 people have been killed in the country's civil war. >>> a u.s. capitol police officer is in the hospital this morning after being hit by a car. this happened around 8:30 last night around massachusetts avenue in northeast washington. we're told the officer was hit during a traffic stop. her condition has not been released. so far no charges have been filed a
they're also concerned that the fiscal cliff is keeping jobs from hiring. vice president joe biden will have lunch with a group of middle class americans. their taxes could sky rocket if congress and president obama don't reach an agreement on a budget by the end of the year. the white house has highlighted several middle class families' struggles in making the case for a deal. >>> in syria tensioned at a boiling point between rebels and the government. syrian rebels have declared...
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if we go off the fiscal cliff and congress doesn't take any action to soften the blow, tax rates will go up quite a lot on dividends, from 15% to more than 40% in most circumstances. there are economists who think that will have a big impact on stock markets and they could go down 10%, maybe 20%. i do not think those effects are as strong as some economists believe. i think it is something the market could get over. you're in a long term tax and vanished savings situation. i think you are basically going to be fine unless you're planning on retiring release soon. i do think that is something you have to keep in mind. diversification out of the assets that are most affected by these kinds of taxes is probably never a bad idea. host: john mckinnon is a reporter for "the wall street journal." he is now in the washington bureau. he was a columnist for "the miami herald." what sectors would be hit harder if deductions and loopholes or taken out of the tax code? guest: the stocks that pay a high dividend. these tend to be utility stocks. there are lots of old, established, u.s. industrial f
if we go off the fiscal cliff and congress doesn't take any action to soften the blow, tax rates will go up quite a lot on dividends, from 15% to more than 40% in most circumstances. there are economists who think that will have a big impact on stock markets and they could go down 10%, maybe 20%. i do not think those effects are as strong as some economists believe. i think it is something the market could get over. you're in a long term tax and vanished savings situation. i think you are...
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>> yeah. >> blake, if there is a deal to avoid the so-called fiscal cliff, could these jobs numbers get considerable better? >> i think so, but it's funny. the republicans are in a bit of a box here. their motivation is to say it's not so good. a lot of jobless people out there. we have a real problem. meanwhi meanwhile, we have fiscal cliff negotiations where the president wants stimulus mechanisms including an extension of unemployment insurance. they're like a doctor who diagnosed you with a severe ill sxns won't sign the precipitation to give you the medicine. they emphasize the joblessness problem, and they don't want to give you unemployment insurance and tell that to someone laid off sleeping in their car. >> with these jobs numbers, had hurricane sandy not struck how better would this report have been? >> a lot of this was construction job weakness. clearly, that will rebound. one of the unfortunate upsides of natural disaster is that you do, whether the states or federal governments do it or insurance companies, you have a lot of infrastructure spending as people rebuild from t
>> yeah. >> blake, if there is a deal to avoid the so-called fiscal cliff, could these jobs numbers get considerable better? >> i think so, but it's funny. the republicans are in a bit of a box here. their motivation is to say it's not so good. a lot of jobless people out there. we have a real problem. meanwhi meanwhile, we have fiscal cliff negotiations where the president wants stimulus mechanisms including an extension of unemployment insurance. they're like a doctor who...